“But I like the storytelling”: a Brian Azzarello Interview
by Antonio Solinas and Emiliano Longobardi

 

     Hi Brian, do you want to introduce yourself? I am always intrigued by how the people that we interview introduce themselves.

     Me saying my name is intriguing?

     No, I think that the way people introduce their work is revealing.

     Ok, then I would say: “Hello, my name is Brian Azzarello and I write 100 Bullets”.

     Great. How did you decide to become a writer and how did you make your debut in comics?

     I never made debut comics. I know there are a lot of people, in this business, for which comics is the job they wanted for all their entire lives. I am not one of those people. I didn’t want to do this. I just got stuck in comics along the way.

     Do you regret it?

    Sometimes (laughs).

     Your first work I remember is Jonny Double. Did you write anything else, prior to that?

     I had written for various anthology titles that Vertigo was putting out at the time, such as Weird War Tales and Gangland. But my first extended work was Jonny Double.

     I think Jonny Double was already very mature and very complete in the way it presented you as a writer. How difficult was it for you to write your first major work?

     The most difficult thing was that when you write your first comic there is a certain level of trust that you don’t have. That editors don’t have, if you know what I mean (laughs).
Now I can pretty much get away with anything, but back then every word that I wrote was gone over. Which is why I write so few words, I suppose.

     You make up for it with quality, then, I guess. After that, basically, you did 100 Bullets. How did you conceive the book and how much of the original idea is there, now?

     I’d say all of it. All of the original idea is there. I pitched 100 Bullets the same time I pitched Jonny Double. Axel Alonso was the editor I was pitching to, and he thought it would be better to try to get a 4-issue miniseries off the ground, rather than trying to launch an ongoing series which would turn out to be essentially too unknown creator-wise.
In the middle of Jonny Double, DC realised they didn’t have anything lined up for either me or Eduardo Risso, and they approved 100 Bullets just to keep us busy, I think.

     A very good move, I suppose. Especially in the era of “decompressed storytelling”, since your writing is not decompressed. What do you think of “decompressed storytelling”, and how do you approach writing?

     I think “decompressed storytelling” was invented by people that read comics. I don’t think it was invented by people that create comics. I don’t buy into that, especially when I construct stories. I don’t think there’s any fat in anything I write. Everything is lean. If I write a 6-issue comic, it’s a lean 6-issue.

     Exactly. I find you use exactly the space that’s needed to tell the stories. How do you work on joining the different story arcs? Do they flow naturally or do you feel the need to use “fill-in” stories?

     They flow pretty naturally for me (laughs). I am not sure if they flow just as naturally for the reader…

     Of course they do. But sometimes there are things to tell that maybe you had not thought of when you started…

     Yes, in some regards, but… You know, I tend to think that the people that read 100 Bullets are pretty bright. Not only they don’t like to have everything explained, they appreciate it’s not.

     You collaborated with a lot of foreign artists. How do you find working with them?

     How does it look?

      It looks good…

     Okay, that’s how I feel about it (laughs). The proof is in the final product, that’s what I feel.

      I was interested to know if for you dealing with American artists is different that dealing with Argentineans or Italians…

     No, it’s not different at all. You know, there are a few American artists I worked with that have been a bit more interested about talking more about what to put on the page, but I really don’t see the reason for that (laughs). That’s why I like to work with foreign artists a lot better. They don’t talk as much (laughs).

     If you were to write for a different medium, which one would it be?

     Stage (plays). That’s what I would prefer.

      Is it true that your scripts are quite concise in the fact that you work most on the dialogues and not so much on the staging of the action?

     The art direction? I really tend to leave most of that stuff to the artist. That’s where an artist can contribute creatively to the story, rather than just being “rendering” what the script says.
That’s where they bring their voice to the story. I look at this as a collaborative medium. I don’t think I am the director.

     That seems very apparent with Risso’s work. There seem to be a lot of contributions from his side. Has he ever pissed you off drawing something he shouldn’t have?

      No. I mean, there have been a few times when we had to go back and get patches on the pages. But that was only because there was an element that needed to be there, for a plot point, I mean: a gun that was supposed to be shown, and wasn’t, things like that. As far as background characters and all that, I never got pissed off: as a matter of fact, I enjoy seeing what Eduardo comes out with, I like to see it.

      What is your approach to writing? What does it mean to you? How do you change your way of writing when you write your stuff compared to when you write a major comic icon (if you change it)?

     You know that I don’t change it at all? Which is why, probably, so many people that were big fans of those iconic characters had real trouble with what I was doing (laughs).

      In this respect, you were criticised for your Hellblazer run with Corben, because some people found the series too “hardboiled” when it shouldn’t have been. Did it concern you?

     No, not at all.

      When you wrote that story arc, did you chose your approach because it was natural for you or because you thought that Constantine needed to be guided in a different direction that no one had explored before you?

     I thought he should be taken to a different direction. You know, I was approached to write a horror book and I am sorry but devils and monsters are not horrifying to me, people behaviours are horrifying. That’s the direction I chose to take. And then Mike (Carey, N.d.R) took it back to, you know, demons, ghost, that supernatural cult stuff. I am sure someone will take him down to a different path. That’s one great thing about the Constantine character, more so than any other comic icon (for lack of a better word): the character lent himself to having a writer putting a stamp on him.

     How much did you know about the character, when you wrote his stories?

     I had read some stuff, but not all of it.

     Is this your ordinary M.O.? How much did you research into the history of Batman and Superman, for example?

     It’s hard not to know those characters (laughs). Actually, I probably read more Constantine (stories) than I read Batman and Superman.

     What did you try to bring to the table when approaching those characters?

     With Batman, I wanted to treat the costume like a trenchcoat, to give him a bit of an edge. I wanted to write the perfect story (laughs).

     I liked the way you portrayed Cage, making him shady and ambiguous. What was the story you wanted to tell?

    I wanted to make him a bit more shady and ambiguous (laughs). I think that for whatever reason, maybe simply because it’s easy, it seems every that every superhero that there is has got the same set of morals. And that’s just not true, in the way people are. That’s what I was trying to do. Cage is a good guy, but maybe he deals with things a little differently, he’s a little bit shady, but his goal is the same. And it’s interesting: the way the comic end can change. If you were familiar with the character, then of course he is bulletproof and the bullets bounce off, but if you never read that character, then he dies (laughs).

     I have to admit I found it a bit disconcerting, in fact. Another thing that I found interesting in Cage, as well as in 100 Bullets, for example, is the fact that you seem to have a very good ear for the streets. How do you get your inspiration for ghetto slang and things like that?

     I listen to the way people talk. I hang out in the city.

     Cage was very well researched, in that respect…

     I tried to do a hip hop superhero.

     And Corben was really good as well…

     When isn’t he good? (laughs).

     Your stories deal with some minorities (like black people, mafia guys, Mexicans). Have you ever been afraid of using too many stereotypes?

     I don’t think I used any stereotype. I don’t think so. So, I guess the answer would be: “No, I am not afraid”.
I don’t see what difference colours make, I am interested in what makes people tick. I mean, in 100 Bullets there are wealthy white people that are just as bad as the poorest schmucks.

     You are working on Loveless for Vertigo, with artist Marcelo Frusin. How did you decide to do a western story?

     I did a western about four years ago called El Diablo and… when I was done with that I wanted to do another one (laughs). So I came up with Loveless, but DC wasn’t that keen on doing it, because El Diablo did not sell that well, so they didn’t think there was a market for westerns and they were trying to push me in a different direction.
So, when I finished with Hellblazer, and Marcelo and I were saying our goodbyes, we talked about working together again in the future, because we had a really good chemistry. I was going over several different ideas, and I mentioned I wanted to do something with an outlaw, and Marcelo just jumped with that, because we are both huge fans of the western genre, and spaghetti western in particular. And that’s basically how it all came together.
So I said to him: “you want to do a western, I want to do a western, I’ll make DC let us do a western” (laughs).

     Are you a big movie fan?

     Current movies? Not really (laughs). But the older films, yeah.

     What are your sources of inspiration?

     My number one source of inspiration is the newspaper, it’s reading the newspaper everyday.

      Would you be interested in working for different publishers, like Marvel, or even for different markets, like the French one?

     Yeah, I could do that. As far as working for Marvel is concerned, I don’t know if I will work with them again. Certainly not for the next year, as I am exclusive to DC. I am not going to say never: every once in a while I might need a change. I don’t think I did enough Hulk.

      What are the differences between writing something for Vertigo and for DC? Does it feel the same to you or not?

     With DC, those are characters that you are doing, who are involved in other people’s stories. Also, there are certain things that you can’t do with those characters, which leads things to be kind of frustrating: this is something I don’t have to worry about in Vertigo.
The work I am doing with Vertigo right now is creator-owned, so the characters are mine.
If I want to kill them, I can kill them. If I want to make a character cheat on his wife, I can do that. Which I wasn’t able to do in Superman (laughs).

     Oh. You are working to a Batman story with Matteo Casali for Wildstorm…

     That was supposed to be for the foreign market. I said yes when it was pitched to me, because it was directed to the foreign market.

      Did you approach it differently from the stories you wrote for the American market?

     I guess the approach has been a bit different. Geographically things are different, plus I have to let Matteo do some stuff (laughs). That sounded bad, I just meant Matteo is involved too: there are two writers and I don’t want to step on his toes.

     How do you find working with Matteo?

      I hate it, I hate it (laughs). I will never do it again. The biggest mistake of all my life was saying yes to working with Matteo.

      Why do you find it so difficult then?

     No, obviously I am kidding (laughs).

      Be careful or Matteo is going to send some mafia killers to your house…

     Either that or he is going to jump out of a building (laughs). It’s been difficult because there is another collaborator, I suppose. But he is doing a really good job, you know, I am real happy with the work he’s done.

      But after Batman: Europe, you are never going to work with a co-writer again…

     No, I will never work with another writer again.

     Is there anything you feel you haven’t accomplished in comics?

     Oh, I don’t know. I think I would like to be able to do Loveless for the next 4 years…
I would like to finish some stories that I am working on right now, and I would like to go directly to a graphic novel format. I would like to bypass the monthly comics format.
Unfortunately, in this kind of market I am really not too sure it’s the right way to go.
With the monthly stuff, you get a little publicity once a month, you know? (laughs)
It doesn’t seem retailers and fans are ready. The market doesn’t seem to be set up to take a book and promote it. Books do not seem to be able to generate buzz for more than a week. After that, everybody moves on to next week’s book. I would like a regular publishing, where a book can have life for, say, 6 months.

      Do you think DC understands this problem?

     Oh yes, they know it. I have been talking to them to try and see how it would be possible to rectify this problem, to change the way this market is set up.

     What is the wrongest thing in American comics right now?

      The wrongest thing? Oh my God! I can’t say, I would be in trouble… (laughs)
You know what the wrongest thing is? I’ll say it: the wrongest thing are these company-wide events, that are forcing readers to buy everything. It seems like every company is doing them, now.

      I think it’s a gimmick to keep the direct market alive…

     You know what? If that’s the case, then they are the greatest thing in comics, not the wrongest. Or could it be that it is the greatest and the wrongest thing in comics?

      Possibly. But I think a lot of people, like me, just want those fat 100 Bullets TPs to read in one go.

     Yeah, me too.

      Maybe it’s just me, but American monthly comics, compared to the collected editions, look disposable.

     Well, until you put them in a plastic bag…

     Your stuff gets translated in other languages. Have you ever thought about how difficult it is to translate your wordplays?

     Yeah, I have heard it from different translators. Some stuff does not translate at all.

     Does this worry you?

     Obviously not. Thanks a lot! (laughs)

     Do you ever think about your audience, when you write?

     No, the only audience I think about is the editor, because he signs the voucher. (laughs)

     That’s probably the best way to approach your job, because if you worry too much about the public…

    … then you end up doing what the public wants, and they don’t usually want what’s best (laughs). What the public tends to want is what they already have, and I am not in the business for that.

     What is it that you are going to give them next?

     What am I going to give them next? Some comedy! (laughs)

     You vary very much the level of violence and swearing in your stories, and I am referring, for example, to Hellblazer compared to 100 Bullets. Do you put any thought in it, or doest it come natural for different stories?

     With 100 Bullets we like to keep a lot of the violence off camera, it’s just an approach that Eduardo and I are taking. In some cases, like that horrible place in Hellblazer, to get the maximum impact, you have got to show it, to get the shock. You have to see it happen.

     You did the Sgt. Rock graphic novel with Joe Kubert: Joe told me he asked you not to put any swearwords and you obliged. Did you feel intimidated by the fact that you were working with such a comic icon?

     No, not at all. I had no problems working with Joe. Living out the swearwords was the only compromise that had to be made, and that’s minor, as far as I see it. Of course I had a lot of respect for Joe: he asked for no swearing. Fine.
Jim Lee had the same request for Superman. The same: I respected Jim, so no swearing.

     Kubert, Corben and Jim Lee have graphic styles that are as different as you can get. How was working with them and did the approach change?

     I could have had a different approach, but Jim asked me not to. He did not want me to change anything. He wanted to see what my scripts were like, and wanted the same freedom that I allegedly allow everyone else. So I gave him exactly what I give anyone else.

     Your scripts leave a lot of space to the artist. Did anyone ever complain about having too much freedom?

     Oh yeah… (laughs) Tell me the name of one artist you ever heard that complained they had too much freedom. That artist doesn’t exist!

     It would be quite entertaining…

     As I said, that artist doesn’t exist, sorry (laughs).

     Do you follow comics regularly?

     Some.

      Which ones?

     Are you asking me what I read recently?

      Yes. Or if there are people whose work you always follow. People always mention Mike Mignola…

     I read Hellboy every once in a while. My wife follows it regularly.
I loved Joe Kubert’s last two books, Yossel and Jew Gangster. They were great.

     Did you read more comics, before working in this business?

     Yes, I kind of did. But now I don’t read as many comics as I used to. I really rarely read a monthly one. You know, I don’t like to wait.

      Do you know anything about European comics and Italian comics in particular?

     Yeah. I wouldn’t say I am an expert on them, but I have actually got a bunch of Italian comics. Tex, for example, and Diabolik. I really like Dylan Dog. It’s a shame it’s translated so sporadically: in fact, Italian comics don’t really get translated over here in the US.

     Is there any particular aspect that you like about foreign comics, compared to American comics?

      Yeah. People don’t fly and punch each other (laughs).
The stories are more grounded. And I find that the storytelling for European artists is more important than for American artists. American artists like the flash. They want a lot of splash pages and things like that. It’s also what the audience wants. But I like the storytelling. That’s probably why I like American movies from the seventies.

      Is there any comic writer whose work you like particularly or any writer whose work you don’t like at all?

     If I don’t like it I don’t read it. I cannot think about anyone off the top of my head whose stuff I really like. I like Dave Lapham’s Stray Bullets: I haven’t read his Batman, so I don’t know about that. I liked Dave Gibbons’ The Originals. He did a Green Lantern story recently: I didn’t read it (laughs).

      You seem to be different from many writers that try to be “rockstars”: you don’t brag about how you are going to change comics…

     You know why? ‘Cause I’m not going to change comics. (laughs)

      What do you think about this “rockstar” mentality? Is it any good for comics?

     I really don’t know.

     Does it bother you, though?

     Sometimes it does. Personally, I think the work should be the focus of all. My work is more important than I am. That is what is going to survive. If anything survives me, it’s going to be the work. I have no desire to be a celebrity, I like to get away with things (laughs).

     Our final question: name three comics that a real fan should have on his shelf. You can probably get away with two, because the third is 100 Bullets…

     See, I wasn’t even going to say that (laughs). I really should learn to hype myself better (laughs). Going back to your last question, the comics that everyone should have on their shelf are probably the first Sin City, or really any Sin City. 300 was fantastic too, no doubt about that. So see, there’s someone I follow all the time, and that’s Frank (Miller). I like Ronin better than I like The Dark Knight… I just got it, and I think it’s great, Charles Burns’ Black Hole: I put that there. As for the third one, I don’t know… I am looking at my bookshelf (laughs)!

      Do you not want to say Watchmen, for example?

     Why would I want to say that? I wouldn’t want to… I mean, Watchmen is great, but I don’t know if it has to be on your shelf. It’s great, but at the end of the day it’s still a superhero story, and that does not appeal to me much. It’s a great character story… Alright, I will say Watchmen, so you give me a break (laughs).

      Thanks, Brian.